A very gay ‘Last Supper’ in San Francisco
—Posted by Tim Nudd |
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September 25, 2007 | Permalink |
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Oh give me a break. Where's the attack in this?
Posted by: Caroline | Sep 25, 2007 4:05:40 PM
at least the Jesus is black. that's better than Da Vinci's.
Posted by: Neesh | Sep 25, 2007 4:48:33 PM
Caroline, here's the problem. Liberals get riled up when anyone mentions "Merry Christmas" instead of "happy holidays" in an ad, when a public school takes kids to watch "A Christmas Carols," it's not even politically correct for kids to sing christmas songs, and if a valedictorian student mentions "Jesus" during her graduation speech, she can get in real trouble.
And yet it's ok for a bunch of leather loving liberals to make fun of Christianity. What hipocrisy, I wonder if they would have made an add ridiculing Mohammed? Too bad Christians don't react like Muslims, rioting and killing innocent people.
Frankly, I have no problem with the ad, I don't mind making fun of religion PROVIDED that religion isn't censored in other arenas. But will Christians be offended by this ad? They'll certainly will. And it's pure hipocrisy that liberals claims we have to be oh so sensitive and yet they don't mind portraying Jesus as a leather daddy.
Posted by: Bobby | Sep 25, 2007 4:58:02 PM
It's definitely not the type of image that will foster understanding. It is antagonizing in nature, for sure. I don't think it should be censored, but I'm also not so sure about the proliferation of rubber fists in our pop culture. I not sure I want to add an explanation of fisting to my birds and bees lecture. And then little Jenny, the big macho bee inserts the rubber fist into...
Posted by: thatguy | Sep 25, 2007 5:13:30 PM
Bobby I really dont see the conection between state run organazations taking a bunch of kids to see religious events and a private group creating an ad that makes fun of religion? Maybe if the state created the ad? Because I don't think any "liberals" would be upset if a private school took some kids to see a Christmas Carol. You completely missed the issue.
Posted by: | Sep 25, 2007 6:01:04 PM
(*yawn*)
secularists taking the piss out of Christ and His Church. Again.
Boring.
Posted by: Louise | Sep 25, 2007 8:54:55 PM
Louise: Just boring enough to merit your vocalized boredom. Awesome.
Posted by: Dave | Sep 25, 2007 11:09:43 PM
I'd like to know if Folsom is footing the bill for the police securoty or not. That's really the only issue here. Otherwise, it's a public group promoting something. I'm sure something far worse to Christians has been on an ad for a concert that no one went to that was posted all over town and no one cared because no one saw it. But gays are scary, I guess, so a male lawyer for a league of activist female Christians says I shouldn't be allowed to show this. Is it posted all over town, or just in gay districts and online?
Posted by: Matt | Sep 26, 2007 12:51:35 AM
As a gay Christian, I cannot be bitterly offended by this because I understand the creators, and thus am free from harsh judgment. The church has a long history of smashing entire people groups (ref: blacks and the Hamitic curse theology), GBTL included. You can't apply pressure to a group of people without expecting one of two reactions: a humble hope for the future, or a belligerent movement for change. This picture isn't going to build any bridges, but don't pretend like it's not expected: the church has tried to legally take away any form of happiness gay and lesbian persons can hope to have, without offering alternatives or a compassionate hand or even an honest discussion. And now this comes up and what does the church do? Sadly, it does the same as any oppressive regime, and it commands the oppressed to tow the line (since we're too evolved to just stone them). Just like the WASPS who expect blacks to stop being silly and stop striving for power and status (note mainstream hip-hop culture) and value education and economic success despite centuries of disempowerment, bigoted heterosexuals with poorly exegeted values of gender, gender roles and marriage will try their very hardest to suppress these dissenters. The status quo is easier, more common and thus goes unchallenged in favor of harsh judgments and compassionless attitudes. My fellow believers, Jesus left that painting long ago.
Posted by: Don | Sep 26, 2007 3:32:18 AM
Is even "making fun" of Jesus or just some painter's centuries old romanticized interpretation of Jesus's last supper in oil paint?
Or maybe there are clues we should be looking for. Dan Brown's hand seems all over this.
Posted by: Ted | Sep 26, 2007 9:10:28 AM
So, Don, what's it like being a self-hating "Christian?"
Posted by: V the K | Sep 26, 2007 10:13:00 AM
Well, let's suppose a Christian group recreated the scene of Matthew Shepard's death, only they dressed the model representing him in drag and put a festive party hat on him.
I am sure gays would never take offense at that. I mean, it's just taking artistic liberties with a historical image. Certainly, no one would interpret it as hatred or antagonism. Right?
Posted by: V the K | Sep 26, 2007 10:55:21 AM
Matt,
If as "gay" christian you're not offended by this than you're showing your true colors arent' you. You need to repent and ask God's forgiveness for embracing your sin instead of seeking His strength to overcome it.
Posted by: Me | Sep 26, 2007 2:43:36 PM
I am deeply offended by this poster. I have many gay friends, so I have nothing against it, but this is just plain wrong. How could they even think of using this as an ad.
Posted by: AN | Sep 26, 2007 2:45:06 PM
As for the ad.
The people who mock God may laugh now and think it's all fun and giggles. But later will come the weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Unless they repent.
Posted by: Me | Sep 26, 2007 2:45:49 PM
Don, this ad has nothing to do with being gay but with the leather lifestyle. Don't confuse one with the other.
Second, while I understand the Folsom street fair is about comedy and s/m, I don't understand the need to ridicule Jesus.
This is typical ad agency double standard. My clients want me to do ads for the holidays but they won't allow me to say Santa Claus, Merry Christmas, or anything that actually celebrates the holidays. I can't even do a fucking radio about kids writing letters to Santa. Why? Because liberals have convinced my clients to be PC. And yet the advertising agency for the Folsom weirdoes has no problem making fun of Jesus. No wonder conservatives are pissed. It seems obvious that you can't mention God or Jesus in an ad unless you're ridiculing them.
Posted by: Bobby | Sep 26, 2007 3:40:38 PM
I'm not impressed or surprised by this ad, after all, this is san fransisco. Most people who are straight and christian will be offended by this ad. I think that there are also some gays who would be offended by this ad. The gay community was, is, and will always be pathetic and misguided. This is just another form of far left liberalism that will result in the destruction of this country. As for San Fran, this city would support the mentally ill perverts (such as the ones depicted in this blasphemous ad)over the military who defends you and allows you to continue your sinful way of life. To the gays in san fran, may you come to your senses before it is too late. Mainstream america recognizes your way of life as immoral even though most would not confront you on the issue.
Posted by: Dino | Sep 26, 2007 9:25:14 PM
Bobby I completely agree with you. Unfortunately liberals will not hear you as they are completely self righteous in all their actions.
Posted by: Ray NY | Sep 26, 2007 10:14:51 PM
I am appalled at this painting, however, I have come to realize that faithophobia exists in all forms in America. This, to me. is NOT simply an issue of sexual preference, but of hate, and, yes,fear! Many of my gay friends probably feel affronted by this, also, but I didn't want to ask them, because they would probably be hurt that I even wondered what their opinion of this would be. I say to the people who put these things out there for the public to see~ Don't be afraid of Christ. He doesn't force Himself on ANYONE. He is a gentleman. be you straight, or gay.
Posted by: | Sep 27, 2007 9:41:02 AM
I am appalled at this painting, however, I have come to realize that faithophobia exists in all forms in America. This, to me. is NOT simply an issue of sexual preference, but of hate, and, yes,fear! Many of my gay friends probably feel affronted by this, also, but I didn't want to ask them, because they would probably be hurt that I even wondered what their opinion of this would be. I say to the people who put these things out there for the public to see~ Don't be afraid of Christ. He doesn't force Himself on ANYONE. He is a gentleman. be you straight, or gay.
Posted by: Rose | Sep 27, 2007 9:44:06 AM
hey matt, first of all, you are not a gay christian. I myself am not "christian"
but I know enough about christianity to know that you cannot be a christian. you may believe in god and christ and go to church...but according to that book you believe in you are a "sinner", plain and simple. I love the way all these different religous groups are panddering shamelessly. Im john and I am a homicidal christian...wow. Ive heard the arguments for gays in church "the bible says not to lay down with men....if we do it standing up we are ok!!" Soooooo lame.
Neesh put it so perfectly, I can say much more. The ACLU will defend anyone or anything...expect a white christian. Its insane. This country is abusing the constitution and taking free speech to an extreme. We need to take the country back and bring back morals and ethics. Not to say the christians are right, but this whole thing makes me sick.
john
Posted by: john | Sep 27, 2007 10:34:44 AM
Ever to note the most irrelevant observations, I still am thinking that at the Last Supper everybody sat on the floor and ate. So was Leonardo just advertsing for a table and chair furniture company?
Posted by: nancy | Sep 27, 2007 10:51:32 AM
"Bobby I completely agree with you. Unfortunately liberals will not hear you as they are completely self righteous in all their actions."
---Thanks Ray. Don't give up the hope. Liberals ARE NOT the majority.
Posted by: Bobby | Sep 27, 2007 1:14:55 PM
I just thought it was hilarious that the spokesperson for the "concerned citizens" group referred to the alleged homosexual attack on the church as "unprovoked". LOL! I wonder if she managed to keep a straight face.
Posted by: Andrew | Sep 27, 2007 6:14:43 PM
Perhaps I said too much and too little. Andrew, you embody the truth of the issue. That does not, however, petulant vindictiveness that people accustomed to oppression should show. This ad is ludicrous. But what I read when I read this blog is a bunch of people afraid, not offended. Afraid that their way of life is on the way out. And I stand by my conviction that you brought this about. I am angry at whoever made this ad for burning bridges and being just plain mean by taking sacred symbols that real people use to understand their faith (Jesus didn't paint it after all, the original had plenty of errors, like, for instance, a white Jesus) but I am angrier at the people who claim to be defending Jesus but in reality are using Jesus to uphold their compassionless attitudes. Here is a simple formula: sin = destruction. Therefore, if some one is sinning, you should be moved to compassion for that person not outright hatred. Like the Buddhist monk Thich Nhat Han said (oddly echoing the truths of Christ): "If you look deeply into your anger you will see that the person causing the anger is also suffering, and in that moment your anger will turn to compassion." Suffering should understand suffering, but sadly, suffering causes fear, anger and hatred. Maybe if Thich Nhat Han was too ethereal, Yoda was on the dot" "Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, and hate to the darkside." Usually the finger that you point so hatefully at others is nothing more than the same finger you are pointing at yourself. Gays and Christians both.
To those who think gay and Christian doesn't work, I challenge you to good hermeneutics, and correct understanding of the nature of inspiration.
Posted by: Don | Sep 28, 2007 1:57:36 AM
That does not, however, JUSTIFY petulant vindictiveness....
Posted by: oops....Don again | Sep 28, 2007 1:58:28 AM
Hey Don, you're right, this does create unnecesary tension between two groups that already have problems getting along.
"the original had plenty of errors, like, for instance, a white Jesus"
---That's not an error, some jews are white, others black, brown, asian, they come in all colors. It's a religion, not a race. And it offends me that anyone would suggest that Jesus was black. Unless you were there, you don't know what color he was. But if you want to paint him black in your church, that's your right.
Posted by: Bobby | Sep 28, 2007 7:56:32 PM
I said nothing indicating he was black. I haven't even seen Color of the Cross, yet. And I don't go to a black church anymore. I'm imagining he wasn't European-looking though, nor was John nearly that boyishly attractive. It's my guess that, being born in the Middle East, he looked more Middle-Eastern than European. But like my mother's Jesus bust with flowing brown hair, high cheekbones, low-bridged nose and light-skinned complexion, the original painting was created via the cultural lens of the European artist. This reflects a base level truth, but a truth nonetheless: that God is recognizable by all people and salient to all races (so in that sense, Jesus can be black, white, Chinese or Native American). My point wasn't that Jesus was black - though the thought seems to offend you severely (or you just look for things to get angry about), but that the inaccuracies that laden the original are both abundant and inscrutable to the white believer (which is a truth that underlies such a harsh response to this particular ad - which again, is despicable, but it doesn't seem like I'm talking to the creators or defenders of this ad, but equally despicable attitudes from so called followers of Christ).
On a side note, the fact that you read that previous post and saw me saying that Jesus was black is a very serious sign of hatred. Suggesting that Jesus was not white does not necessitate that Jesus was black. You being offended by a black Jesus both denies a truth that the black community must embrace to better understand God and disacknowledges the fact that you probably cling to the same truth as my mother with her Jesus bust. You seeing the phantom black Jesus in my post hints at a deep seeded racism that is manifest through your anger at my post. Anger is not a launching point for action, but rather for introspection.
Posted by: Don | Sep 29, 2007 1:57:34 AM
Hey Don,
In the middle-east there's a wide variety of colors, not just arab brown. You'll find Iranians with blue eyes for example.
"the original painting was created via the cultural lens of the European artist."
---And in China there's a Jesus with asian eyes. Just like Catholic Church speaks Latin and not aramaic like Jesus did, every culture Christianity religion in a different way.
"which is a truth that underlies such a harsh response to this particular ad"
---The problem is not that Jesus was portrayed as black, the problem is the whole leather, s/m, drag queen scene around. Look, I'm not as closed minded as people think. I respect the s/m lifestyle, if people want to have fun getting dressed, being tied up, and playing games, go ahead. Other conservatives may be shocked by this, but I believe sex is for fun, not reproduction. HOWEVER, making fun of the last supper with an event that it's not even about religion is unnaceptable. As a Christian posted in another blog, "they wouldn't dare make fun of Mohammed because muslims would blow them up."
"You being offended by a black Jesus both denies a truth that the black community must embrace to better understand God"
---I would think blacks are not as superficial as to actually care what color God is.
"You seeing the phantom black Jesus in my post hints at a deep seeded racism that is manifest through your anger at my post."
---No Don, I am not a racist. I did not call Juan Williams a "house negro" for defending the comments Bill O'reilly made. I don't refer to black republicans as "Aunt Jemimas" as a white liberal DJ did. Just because I don't blame whitey for everything doesn't mean I'm a racist. I am intolerant of one thing, bullshit. And when people get angry because there's a white Jesus instead of a black Jesus, that's bullshit.
In fact, I've read there's been a black exodus to the south in the past decade, part of it is because they're happier dealing with honest southeners who speak their minds than dishonest white yankee liberals who kiss up to them in public while talking trash about them in private. Or those liberals in the media that will never criticize anything a black rapper says or does because they're too afraid of being accused of being racist.
This is a terrible ad. It doesn't even have artistic value. If you want to do an ad with a black Jesus, at least show him with respect and not with an s/m motive.
Tell me, how did you feel about the black Virgin Mary covered in elephant dung they showed at MOMA? The one Giuliani called garbage?
Posted by: Bobby | Sep 29, 2007 9:14:32 PM
If non-christians and atheists want christians to respect their beliefs by not solely advocating christian ones, shouldnt they be respecting christians' beliefs in return?
this reminds me of south park, where comedy central censored mohammed but repeteadly allows images making fun of jesus.
Posted by: a | Sep 29, 2007 9:27:48 PM
Hey A, it wasn't South Park, it was Comedy Central. Watch the show again and you'll see the disclaimer they put. I love South Park, they have made fun of Saddam, Osama Bin Ladden, and everything else, but since Christians don't go around killing people when they're offended, Comedy Central isn't afraid of them.
Posted by: Bobby | Sep 30, 2007 12:09:48 PM
My daughter is gay and I think you guys are trying to set a terrible example--and I accept my daughter for what she is but she does go around and make a fool of herself
Posted by: dominic Federico | Sep 30, 2007 6:33:02 PM
These guys suck. Literally.
Posted by: Hillary Clinton | Oct 2, 2007 12:03:22 PM
"Love the Lord your God with all of your heart and soul and mind."
"Love your neighbor as yourself."
The only things we are asked as Christians to do.
Forgive us Lord, for we know not what we do.
Posted by: Patrick | Oct 5, 2007 9:23:46 PM
Check this out: http://youtube.com/watch?v=_DsPraSfqmU
dunno where it´s from but... wow
Posted by: Alex | Oct 6, 2007 7:12:04 PM
I had the pleasure of visiting some one dear to me in Boston this past weekend. While I was walking down the streets of downtown, I noticed an interesting caricature: the Red Socks sitting at the last supper celebrating their victories with the slogan "We're Saved" at the bottom. The picture looked older - it's been around for a while. But who raised hell when the God of sports was being worshiped? Sports exemplify every single one of the attitudes Jesus counters with his beattitudes, but the Church celebrates them with Super Bowl parties!. What a farce the church has become. What a brood of vipers. A new Pharisee class has replaced the old. Mustard seeds, love of enemies, and abundant life has been replaced with delusions of grandeur, us versus them mentalities, and the comfortable life. AHHHHHHH!!!!
Posted by: Don | Oct 9, 2007 9:43:22 PM
Did you ever notice that people are completely into themselves. Christ died for our sins and we mock Him and his teachings such as the advertising ad. Is it good to treat someone that shows you love and kindness with such a lack of respect. Maybe we all should look in the mirror and figure out what we are all about before we go around bashing things we don't understand! Yes it is Faith people have that keeps Christians focused on the Words of God. Yes it says in the bible Gay is an abomination, but it also has many other sins that we all ignore also because we are all sinners. If you don't have the faith I know of a picture that just reminds you that God is at work in all of our lives. www.fireworkscross.org
Posted by: Brett | Oct 16, 2007 12:59:54 AM
http://www.fireworkscross.org/
Posted by: Brett | Oct 16, 2007 1:02:43 AM
For those of you who didn't condemn this blasphemy....I will pray for you! You will need prayer!
Has anyone besides me noticed how GA is getting some much needed rain and how California is on fire(firemen have referred to it as "Armageddon Like")
That being said.......Ga recently had several prayer vigils and asked the Lord for rain.....He has provided again!
So don't wander why is this happening to California......cause I can assure you GOD is not happy with the filth in our world today and if you don't believe that GOD will bring California to it's begging knees then please continue your blasphemy against my Lord and Savior
Posted by: David | Oct 23, 2007 6:10:17 AM
David,
you represent the destruction and bondage that is the direct result of sin. For me, truth is truth because it works in real life. My gay loving committed relationship going on two years has brought me more freedom and well-being than any amount of all night prayer vigil or self-loathing would ever bring. And when I look at the fruit of what you preach, I see nothing but death. You shall know a tree by its fruit, and for every fag you've led away from the cross, you, my brother in Christ, are a bad tree. I seek righteousness that is manifest in the fruits of the Spirit. Love, joy, peace, patience, goodness, kindness, gentleness, faithfulness and self control are my guiding lights - all of which you lack. And that lack defines the sinful nature - obvious to those who know deeply the teachings of Christ and have internalized them. Not only does truth work in real life for it to be truth; it also reveals itself. I dare any so-called Christian who as withheld empathy but not judgment to find the destruction and bondage in my life. And, David, you will see that the fruits of the seeds you sow will be a harbinger of death to all of humanity. I don't have to go to Hell to experience separation from God, all I need is to go into a church. Hear me - please - you are living wrongly.
Don
Posted by: Don | Nov 22, 2007 3:59:51 AM
David,
there are a few more truths at work in your world view that I have to discuss (I want the whole world to know): you project all your violence onto God. Your hatred and your rage naturally play themselves out into violence - and thanks to social conventions, you don't (hopefully) act them out (or maybe your a basher). So you project that violence onto God. For you, he acts on your behalf (praise Him He actually doesn't). Another truth in action - the most terrifying of them all - is that one's perception of God is also her perception of self. Sadly, so very sadly, what you hold me too is also what you hold yourself to. And because you are human and subject to every one of those aberrations that I am, you hate yourself. Just like the violence of your hatred for me is projected onto God, the hatred that you have for me is nothing more than the very hatred you have for yourself. Love your God, love your neighbor, love your self. You can't do any of those. But all it takes is to start with one - just one - of any of the three and you can be free. Truth - Jesus - will set you free. I love you.
Don
Posted by: Don | Nov 22, 2007 4:43:53 AM
I think I have to say one more thing to sidestep mud slinging. In no way to I condone this blatant disregard for such a sacred image that is fundamentally important to so many's identity. It is the exact same mean and hateful spirit that is behind denying gay and lesbian citizens civil liberties and free will to pursue their own happiness. Violence and evil is still rampant in humanity - we've just found different ways to kill each other.
Posted by: Don | Nov 22, 2007 8:49:15 PM
